I'm up for watching some lawn darts!! Oh yeah!

That is sooo yesterday...

Pushed it right out!





Gotta have cheerleaders, right?

Wow. Until now, I was unaware of what had happened...well, I knew something had happened, but I was not sure what is was. I certainly was not aware of a new site, spawned by former "iconic" members.
No ill will towards them at all though. More power to you guys and good luck.

It does crack me up when people break off from a message board to create their own, so they can get away from the "drama". Um...have you not ever been to a message board besides this one? Hate to tell you, but they reek of drama...all of them. There is no escaping that, especially if you the Mods are loose. The new site will get it's share sooner or later. It is inevitable. I do wish them good luck though.

Oh I dont know...
Get together and tell stories about how these kids with there new "round" balls are ruining the game?


Sorry, couldnt help myself

I'll go back into my corner now.

This might be a good time for a group Huggie.

Maybe if this request had been worded differently or the word "attorney" not used maybe there wouldn't be 6 pages of "drama"....

Once again Ted comes through with a gem.


Dodgeball may be too much for a bunch of Internets desk jockeys. Maybe Rock, Paper, Scissors would be more our speed. Just think of how fast our reaction times would be after hours of typing to keep the drama alive.

now that the thread has run it's course, i'll make an honest observation or two:

--->>>Did anyone notice that this thread brought the vbmx members together, rather than divide like it did during the exodus era. That's called healing my friends. very cool.<<<<----

Spike, I expected more of a blade on your post, you let me down my man.

RedBaron, total respect for you. Do you realize you were the ONLY old pro to maintain a high level of integrity and didn't pack up shop during that phase? Much respect to you.

on the bmxa site, those numbers jumped at first because they did personal invites directly from this site and offered free membership to come over and start posting. so the graph is a bit skewed to begin with or it's at least painted VBMX for the first month of the chart.

Greg, why don't you guys get a proper promotional manager instead of a website. you guys should be riding a wave of old glory in the foreign lands selling promotional stuff. From reading your group's vbmx postings, including Oz, I don't think old pro's words were capable of maintaining our respect in this age. well I'll exclude Cash, now that boy is a gem that can write....

but who can be serious too long, being a guy and all.....

what's wrong with you guys, battles are played out by roman candle fights, bb gun fights, or for the sophisticates in the crowd- paint ball guns turned up to full volume. but lawndarts sounds interesting.

carry forth troops!

"Maybe if this request had been worded differently or the word "attorney" not used maybe there wouldn't be 6 pages of "drama"...."

Maybe if Oz would man up and come on here and ask for himself the outcome would be different as well. I guees he's just to "Factory" for us now. LOL!!!!

Once again Bill C. gets slammed by that particular group for trying to help them out. Lame!

Greg wants facts?

Fact is, Oz's attorney called Bill C., at the ABA office I might add, asking Bill to do a favor for Oz.
He asked Bill C. to post the original request that started this whole thread.

With all due respect to those that deserve [list shrinking]....Ben Joy, the one and only is one of the original P.R.O. members....and a mighty cool lad to boot.

Amen. Ben has a bad habbit of downplaying his "role" in the whole history of things. He was there racing with JU, PK and everyone as a SE sponsored rider. The most humble guy alive (and he has two banks )

Shannon,

Oz's attorney called Bill C to request information, this is an ongoing case, it's not new. Bill could of handled this in a way that was not posted on an open thread where people would begin to flame Oz, I have to believe Bill C knew exactly what would happen if he put it out there as he did. Sure you can say he was trying to help however I think he knew the outcome would be Oz getting slammed by lot's of people.. I have had multiple requests for information on my site, you do not always have to post for all to see in order to get that info..

Shouldn't your dialogue be private via PM to Shannon (?)

I think this is why the Arizona BBQ was such a mess, it should have been private not public.

just my .02

you can't always get what you want...

but you will most often get what you ask for....

BMX, collecting BMX bikes, collecting memories and history are way more enjoyable than this crap...

I missesd the so called exodus, I was turned off before it took place. It was obvious that things were getting ugly and divisions were being formed. I took a vacation. Once again another site gets formed. They can all be fun to participate in. Just like back in the day we raced several different sanctions. NBA, IBMX, BMXL, ABA, ETC, ETC, ETC.... Had fun racing all of them. I try to have fun riding on all these different sites.

When garbage like this takes place, it's not fun, even though some of you in a twisted way appear to enjoy it???

Bill,bad choice of a post. I'll give Bill the benefit of the doubt, he probably wasn't thinking, and didn't realize what would happen if he posted this thread. I'll give Bob the benefit of the doubt, maybe he didn't know his attorney was going to make the request that he made. I know how attorneys can be , my dad was one, ( he wrote the original warning decal for JMC). No props to any of the flame throwers, very uncool...

If you want true history, true knowlege of era correct, not self professed knowlege from people who weren't there and weren't directly involved, don't participate in threads that drive the people who were actually, physically there, away.

I think I will take another vacation....

Now that I think of it, I'm glad my kids are into skateboarding


Adam

This is exactly why the AZ BBQ went down the way it did.

It goes like this this-

I read about the AZ. BBQ on this very site. (BMXAO didn't exist at this point) I email Gary saying I have some emials to help him out with finding some people. He has to check with Johhnny Johnson and a few others to make sure I'm legit. (which seems very funny to me) Then I help some more along the way, work with him on scheduling things with our already existing event. Which people were already coming to with or without his BBQ going on. I then print a poster for the event with all the ABA National #1 Pro's on it. Only to be told I should have done it differently. I told them to print their own poster then, this is the one I'm handing out at the Redline pits. LOL!!
Then I send Gary over the Press Release announcing the event, again me helping them out. I ask him to read it, let me know if it needs anything else, or if he wanted to add anything. He then emials me back and says it's good to go and to send it out. So again I help them out by sending it on it's way. He then decides to read the whole thing, goes on the sites slamming me saying ABA and myself are trying to steal his credit/thunder. The whole thing was pretty hilariuos. Not to mention the whole Bryan Esser show that took place after the event. At that point I washed my hands of it.

As most of you know I still, and always will help out tons of people when it comes to keepin' it real with the old stuff and the roots of BMX Racing. The Phoenix event, Rockford event, Roseville event, Hacks at the ABA Nationals, "THE ROOM" at the ABA Grands and so on. I'm totally down to help out with the cause anytime, anywhere. I just pick and choose who I work with a little more carefully. It's not any fun getting kicked in the balls after you go out of your way for someone.

Greg, I see it like this. They asked Bill C. for a favor, he delivered once again. It's like the old saying. Be careful what you wish for, becuase you might get it. They asked and they received.

That was pretty good.




As was that.




Not everyone got an invite. Me, for example, seeing as to how I ruined teh Internets and all.




but if you try sometimes you just might find, you get what you need.



Read Shannon's post again. The lawyer called and asked Bill to post this thread. Bill posted a thread the lawyer asked him to post. The post was:

"Bob Osborn has requested through his attorney if anyone might remember a thread from this forum with the title "Trash Can Morgan wets the Bed".

Bob's attorney is looking for the author of above mentioned thread.

anyone?"

Explain to me how that's somehow outside the rules of civility, please? Anyone?

I was tempted to go on, but see no reason to open old wounds any further. Those who understand already understand, and those who don't apparently never will.

Yes your right, it should be a PM I just gtet caught up in the emotion as many do, Im sorry..What can I say.. Look VBMX is cool, Bill C is cool, and most everyone on here is cool..Internets as Elvis would say....

Greg,

I received a call at work a month or two ago from Attorney Robert Griffin representing Bob Osborn. He asked me about a post titled "Trash Can Morgan wets the bed" and asked if I could find it. I was unable to locate said thread and let him him know via email. I received another call from him the other day, specifically requesting that I post on this forum asking who started the thread. I did extacly as he requested. If you doubt me, ask him yourself

Robert C. Griffin
Crowley, Haughey, Hanson, Toole & Dietrich P.L.L.P.
490 N 31st Street, Suite 500
Billings, Montana 59101 USA
voice 406.255.7275
rgriffin@crowleylaw.com


I did what was requested, that was to post on an open thread. The desired effect has been achieved, Attorney Griffin knows who started the thread and I passed Bens contact info to him.

My last communication with Bob Osborn was him demanding that I remove all images from VintageBMX.com that he shot and now his attorney calls me asking to do this as a favor for Oz.

I took the high road and complied with the request.

BAM!!!

(ooops, I wasn't going to post anymore)

It looks like the Lawyer is to blame. Shakespere was right.

"The first thing we do, kill all the lawyers."

Maybe we should get back to to the basics, using bikes to ride and the Internets to look at midget porn.

Anybody ride their bike today?

YES...I did...

Bill, maybe, just maybe, if you had posted "Does anyone remember who posted the topic about "Trash Can Morgan wets the bed", without the OZ/lawyer reference maybe the person you were looking for would have been found just as easily and alot of this could have been avoided, unless the attorney specifically told you to post it that way. It just seems to me that the way it was posted originally would bring out the drama....just sayin', I'm not siding with anyone.

I'm putting mine back together from Reno. I'll go to the track tomorrow.
Greg you didn't come by and say hi.
I did talk to Todd.
The fender was sweet.

Actually, that was a character in a Shakespeare play who in uttering that was proving himself to the audience to be uneducated rabble as a means of plot device.

I know, I'm a nerd .... a nerd married to a lawyer.

Yeah Henry VI. Something to do with revolution and stuff. Who said majoring in English was a waste of time?

Elvis, I have always wondered with all the time spent on the internets when do you find time for Dungeons and Dragons?

"My last communication with Bob Osborn was him demanding that I remove all images from VintageBMX.com that he shot and now his attorney calls me asking to do this as a favor for Oz."

so I can't post my favorite 'hot shot' on a forum based website?
seriously? Sounds kind of, well, dumb.

Well, I just tried to ride my bike, but it's too cold (8 degrees with 20mph wind).....so, what's new in this thread?

Well, I COULD ride in theory...nice and cool, and kinda overcast like it's wanting to rain. But my daughter's got this stomach bug that's been going around, and today my wife wasn't feeling so hot either, so...

Oh, yeah...the thread. Where were we?

I have to believe we are all adults here.

Me personally, I don't speak with eloquence. I will leave that up to Cash. I try to take a step back before I get emotionally involved. There are plenty of others out there who live to cross swords.

I have a great deal of respect for anyone willing to go to bat to defend a friend. There is not enough loyalty in the world. There is also not enough respect in the world.

Sarcasm has always come easy to me, but my wife the elementary school teacher, told me something once that continually comes into play. If you say something and then have to follow it with, "I was just kidding." Maybe you should not have said it in the first place.

Loyalty and respect can co-exist. The hardest thing on Elvis' internets is to read feeling and emotion. Simple multiple lines in print cannot explain what goes on in the writers heart. Only what is at the very fore-front of his fingertips.

There will be those who read this thread and not have a clue what it's all about. Please get all the facts before passing judgement. Then go for a ride on a bike and remember why we came here in the first place.

It is easy to make enemies, alot harder to make true friends and keep them. I have friends in the BMX community that I have known for over 30 years. I have also made new friends in this past year and a half through Elvis' internets. I prefer to stay neutral, especially since none of this compares to the reality of the real world.

Please people, keep perspective

You just did. Very well put, and very true. We're here because of something that has to do with bikes we rode a while back, right?

That seems to be the case.



Yes, and props to Bill for that!

The readily apparent example, the "History of Freestyle" no longer exists here (as I understand it, I've had to fill in the blanks myself as most of you have too), because it was the intellectual property of someone(s), and deemed; no longer to be volunteered information for the group to enjoy.

OZ, and so many others, was made welcome here, and we were thrilled to share our thoughts and frequent praises with him, and of him. This goes for a lot of high profile members here, whom we were thrilled to have as companions and fellow members.

But, for those who haven't pieced together the "missing links", most of us were flamed here as I see it, in a mass flaming a while back. VBMX became an ego trip for some, and a power struggle for control for others. Exclusivity reared it's head with one word, "Legends". And that exclusive phrase seemed to become, "Legends Only". And IMO an uncontrollable ego trip for some.

This exclusivity, and power struggle continued to rear it's head when the demands that exclusive rights to pictures and editorials be invoked, and all proprietary material be banished from this site. Some members decided that helping us all with this material was no longer to be volunteered. In short, our group was publicly denounced, and threatened (impression of implied legal rights, and possible legal follow up action, to material requested to be removed, ironically, just like the diaper bags), with the power and authority vested in them. ....Is it so difficult to understand that this behavior upsets people?

Now we were being asked to help capture more exclusive rights, to more exclusively owned material. Ironically, from what we could gather in the brief description, it was not even known where the illicit material existed, or what it was exactly, but it was being hunted none the less, and our help was needed.

The vast majority of us here aren't here for power struggles, or inflated egos, we did what we did bitd, because we loved BMX. We are VBMX. Rockford is not exclusive, rather, it is 100% inclusive. We share because it's fun. We create a fun present day pass-time, linked to a past day fun-time.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I have done my best to produce helpful materials in the form of "How To" articles, among others. The ideas are not proprietary, nor exclusive, and info and ideas that I have shared have spread wildly to other people and sites, and I get all the thanks I need from them right here, in the form of "Thank You's", and in seeing the fun, interesting, and positive results being gained from them. To me, that is the spirit of groups like this. Helping, sharing, and enjoying, and being able to receive the reciprocal in return. And, as such, I thank all the other contributors here whole heartedly, for allowing me to learn and enjoy from their offerings, guys like Reilley1 (since I butted him in on a joke earlier, and is one of the coolest and most knowledgeable VBMX characters I've ever met) who continue to produce available, free, and wonderful information on the topic that we all love so much. Nothing more, nothing less.

Nobody ever asked a group of people to leave our fine group of VBMXers. In fact, we were proud to have you, and so many urged you to stay. But it seems apparent, everyone at this site has been disowned by some. When those who disown us, ask for our help, without mending fences first, it creates an irony. Irony, is a basis of humor. Humor is fun.

Prove us wrong. Re-join us, share with us, enjoy with us, as we are not really interested in choosing sides, and never have been, we are only interested in sharing and having fun here. ,,,Or don't re-join us and share, but in the latter, if we choose to play on the ironies formed from the events that unfolded, then there isn't much defense to be had.

Or, ....one can just be a big baby about it.



But most of us are here to share and have fun.

So to that end......


Cheers all...

Pretty cool post Ted.

(by the way, my mom kept some of my baby pictures too... )

Thanks Ted, another cleanup job on my computer desk!

I just got back from a ride with my son. The weather is pefect here.
I think this issue is dead now.

Ok, thanks Ted for the coffee the nostril moment! And the coffee is never better the second time around that way.

Ditto

Bite me It's gonna be 20-30 below here with the wind chill

nice whine there cheez!

Well said, Ted.

Like Ted said, prove us wrong. Oz, we would love to hear from you.

Ted, Thanks!! Much better said than I tried to.

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

awesome ending Bill and Ted...it was an......excellent adventure.

it's so freakin cold here, i think i just heard my z rims pop straight out in the garage.
thanks for that tech tip, by the way. i always wondered if it were true.

just an outsider looking in...but put yourself in Oz's shoes

You've done all you have done for BMX...invested your time, your families time...built memories (mostly pleasant)

When it's time to go share some time with the people you made the memories with, do ya' go where they are going to shake your hand and welcome you in or do you go where you know you will be met with both friend and foe? (foe may be a tad strong, but just trying to make a point)

Let him see that you can still shake his hand is all I'm saying...

As many have said....just my 2c

We're still talking about this?!?!

Sheesh, go ride a bike you people.....

This is what many of us are still pretty bent about. Members of this site spent countless hours and provided volumes of research and historical evidence to formulate a timeline of events. Is it right for someone to compile all that evidence and then claim rights to it? Doesn't seem fair to me, but maybe that's just how it goes. I'm working on my own time line based on the same content provided by all of you and will create a page for the site soon and will claim no rights to it whatsoever since all of you did the research. Sorry for picking an old scab... move along.. this thread is over.

As far as I can see, the sheerly AWESOME humor that has been displayed as a result of this thread would not exist if bill hadn't done what he was asked.

This has to be some of the funniest stuff I read in a long time.

Bump

I'm behind on all this drama, and I'm surprised, I'm thinking this cant be real, in my youth, reading bmxa for many years, I totally looked up to OZ. and many other pros , thought they were the coolest ever! as for BMXA, I scraped pennies and nickles so I can get an issue. worked hard in strawberry fields, newspaper routes, sawmill @ 15 yrs old. Being deaf, believe me, it was HARD getting a job.

but now this? what the f%^*? if it's about the money, fku!

Reminds me of some Metallica member whining for $$$ few yrs ago.

but then, I will always remember and cherish my youth, the feeling of looking forward to the newest issue of BMXA.

if I dont make any sense, just ignore me, I speak in deafenese

Greg Hill,
I remember your number plates BITD, had sticker of "Jesus" on a key.. and the GHP nora decal had it too. I admired that. But doesnt that tell you that you need to forgive, love your enemy? not to judge others. etc?

Come on and let this go and don't read so much into things. (Note to self: Remember this is for fun and a diversion from being grown up).

Greg is good guy. He comes out swinging just like he did on the track. I'm pretty sure he'd do the same in person, then have a laugh with you. He is also the same guy who came to Rottenfish and entertained us all.

Regarding the topic on this thread, Oz has the right to pursue compensation for his photo. A professional graphic designer scanned a photo that was published in a magazine. He/She knew what they were doing. Using a lawyer to handle lifes unpleasantries is not a bad thing.

Anything between my friend Bill C and Oz is between them. But I'd likely jump in, like Greg did for his freind, if Bill C was being trashed about.