Guess what just showed up on my doorstep 5 minutes ago!?

My/Our next Oxalic acid specimen! Mark K just showed up with this gem taken off of the top of a dumpster/recycle bin. YES they are STILL throwing them away!

I need help on dating this one, but it looks to me like a 77! As it is stamped 10 77 1 on the BB.

SCORE! Way to go Markus!










It has an unusual gusset on the BB. Sup with that? I am thinking this is an unusually rare specimen!

Team Mongoose competition racing frame....is on the decal.

[ November 17, 2006, 08:09 PM: Message edited by: Ted Carl ]

Very unusual. I thought only 1976 model had the gussett by the bottom bracket? Obviously wrong decals.

i thought 1976 too...no?

Not sure. I am not the goose guy.

The decals sure look original. Tell us more!

Is that stamp an Oct of 77 stamp? Or something else?

We will have to look for a S/N on it as well...

I can't believe the things people throw out. Nice score.

I'm saying `75/`76.

That's the serial number, not the date. The very earliest `geese had it hand stamped into the BB. The CB bracket & seat stay gusset point to `75/`76, and I don't believe I have seen a serial number earlier than this one. Randy's `goose that was at one time thought to be the oldest was #10378.

Sorry, don't know what I was thinking. Definitely a `75/`76, but not older than Randy's, although still a VERY early bike.

Mine is 11994 and I got it in late 1975. Waza has one that is close to your s/n.

Thanks for all the quick info!

It's not mine, so I am not sure of it's fate yet. Thus far, he wants me to dunk it and polish it, and split the proceedes. But he may fall in love with it once he sees what we can do with it.

I reminded him that his brother's goose got stolen at the Omaha Cornhusker National in about 79, and he has stated an interest (a passive one) in getting a goose.

Time will tell, but it may be up for grabs.

It looks realllllly short.

That is a Raleigh/Rampar double bump stem as well.

I am going to take it apart right now, and put-er in the tub overnight. More to come.

By all means, more goose info is welcome, please!

The serial numbers in this style (5 digit) are sequential and are not directly relevant to the date as a code. The later style of serial numbers tell the month and year.

Jeez, did somebody shorten that frame? Looks like one of those VW busses where they cut the middle out and weld the 2 ends together...

Mongoose started making frames in 1975 with serial number like that through late 1976 while keeping that frame design with the extra gusset until 1977 at which time the flared seat stay bracket went straight.

That s/n is not a date. Contact Kilo, he can place it on his registery of goose frame to help guess the year.

Two things I know of to place the year, look at the coaster brake bracket thingy, is it one solid plate or two thin peices welded together? Does it have a caliper brake bracket? Those arrived on 1977 frames, previously without.

The entire decal set is unoriginal...sweet find.

It is taking an Oxallic acid bath as we speak.

It has 2 layers welded together on the C/B bracket.

It has 2 tapped holes where a brake caliper cross piece ,or reflector, or something would attach to the rear triangle. But as it sits there is no provision to attach a brake caliper, unless you screwed a bracket across there or something. Is this a missing piece?

What decals should it have?

Randy and other will confirm, but I believe that it would simply require the already-available VBMX Mongoose Motomag decal sets:



I think you would use the "Mfg. in U.S.A. by RECO Inc." decal on the top tube as opposed to the "Mfd. in U.S.A." shown laying on top.

.....and your wife thought you were drawing that bath for her, didn't she Ted? Ha ha ha

Did you remember to hang up the "DO NOT BATHE: OXALIC ACID!" sign on the bathroom door?

Fork & stem should be non-stamped black oxide Ashtabula's, crank should be either black oxide or chrome non-stamped Ashtabula, sprocket should be either Three Arrows or 5-spoke Schwinn style (not sure if it says Schwinn or not), and bars should be black Mongoose style box-bars. Check out the add below for more details.

Nice find! Looks like a '75 shorty.

Yea, those are the decals you need, sounds like someone once screwed a caliper bracket into your frame.

Two piece coaster brake tab = the earliest design, 1975 and some of 1976.

Thanks guys!

It is making good progress in it's bath!

I am working in a grey area. I suppose I should peel the decals off while it is soaking, but since its ownership remains in question, I need to consult the guy that delivered it! lol

A friend of both of ours saw it, and said, "I bet Ted or Mark would want that", and grabbed it and left it out at his house for us to pick up. Mark plucked it out of his driveway and brought it over here. So it is truly a "Collective decision" thing.

If the holes for a caliper bracket were made after the fact, they did a good job. It looks factory. They are straight, centered, and cleanly tapped. Hard to say at this point.

I can't thank you all enough for the quick info!

waza here,

im staying at quicks place for a couple of days.
Thats definately a 75 goose and is earlier than mine making it the second oldest know surviving goose. as my serial # is 11443

awesome score.

[ November 19, 2006, 08:03 AM: Message edited by: QuicksilverBMX ]

Cool find Ted. That's a '75. Late '75 and '76 did not have that coaster tab. This thread breaks it down too.


web page

Ted, you got PM.

Got pics Ted? How did the Oxalic Acid bath turn out?

Pics to come

It looks like I am going to build this one up!

Findings so far.

The holes drilled for a "Caliper" brake bracket measure too far off to be original. Someone did that on thier own. They will be filled and disappear into a distant memory.

It is going to get some fresh Nickel. Just too far gone to be what it deserves to be.

I need to contact Kilo and get put on the official list!

Randy, is yours a shorty or a longy? You've got nothing to lose here, cus mine's a shorty? lol

It would make mine the oldest shorty if you have the long frame. Otherwise it remains the second oldest known..

Manufactures usually start product numbers with big numbers. I'd bet the bike that Mongoose started with the number 10,000.

That would mean that this one is the 771st mongoose ever made. and Randy's the 256(??)th one.

I think that is pretty cool, since there are probably hundreds of thousands of bikes with the Mongoose name on them now!

[ November 30, 2006, 05:10 AM: Message edited by: Ted Carl ]

BTW, any leads to the parts in the above photo would be appreciated!

Bars? Grips? Seat?

I was reading this an wondering why all the "facts" always have exceptions? Look at this frame (I sold this one over a year and a half ago) it does have the gusset, brake tab and no rear caliper mount. It is a 77 frame!
The other thing you need Ted is just some cheap Motomag 1's - the Ashtabula stuff is the easy part.
What a VERY COOL ride. I know if anyone will do it up cool it will be you!

The facts are indeed difficult to interpret. The brake tab seems easy enough. Mine is laminated from 2 pieces and welded together. The shape is different from your 77 as well. I think the facts are "dead on" here. Early being laminated, later not laminated.



The ashtabula stuff, not that hard, but some are not real apparent yet.

The bars seem to be the difficult one so far.

But the real difficulty is in knowing things like BB, headset, and sprocket. Schwinn had a hand in Early mongoose stuff. (The roger decoster came out of their dealings).

Mine had the Schwinn bearings all the way around, as well as a 36 tooth Schwinn Lucky 7 Sprocket on it. I assume nobody would have installed this later. Not much of an upgrade. However the ad above shows a different Schwinn sprocket installed on it.

So which do I use for the build? It is those kinds of decisions that are difficult to make here. Part of the fun.

The seat post must have been 1/8 inch thick soft iron 15/16 inch steel. what a mess getting that out of a 7/8 inch hole! Ishy. Now what to put back in there?

It is interesting trying to figure out all the details.

Much of the Nickel is just plain gone. Some of it can be polished up nicely, but much of it loses its yellow nickel tint, as it is bare metal that is being polished. It will be like new when I get done with that part of it, and plate it fresh.




T

[ December 03, 2006, 03:15 PM: Message edited by: Ted Carl ]