Full Version: How do I know if my Quad is mild steel?
I probably should be able to figure this out, but after searching around I'm not sure of how to know for sure. I'm wondering if the Loop Quad frame I have is a mild steel version? It has the cross braces so I know that it is an early frame. Pictures can be found here. Can you tell by pictures or only by weight?
im not a pro or anything, but i dont believe any quads were made of mild steel.
yours looks to be a non reynolds frame which would mean its regular 4130 chromo as opposed to reynolds chromo.
if your frame were reynolds it would have the seatstays starting at the seatpost as opposed to the top tube.
at least thats how i understand the differences......
am i right guys?
yours looks to be a non reynolds frame which would mean its regular 4130 chromo as opposed to reynolds chromo.
if your frame were reynolds it would have the seatstays starting at the seatpost as opposed to the top tube.
at least thats how i understand the differences......
am i right guys?
No, I'm fairly sure I remember there being a big deal made about "mild-steel looptail quads" and the fact that they generally fetch around $3k on e-bay
Not sure why, perhaps scarcity..
Not sure why, perhaps scarcity..
Actually, Brian, the early loops were mild steel. I was under the impression that all the loops were mild steel, and when they changed to the new rear end they went to Reynolds. However, I'm also not an expert, so maybe they went to chromo, then changed the design and went to Reynolds.
let's see if i can get this correct: mild steel looptail were first. they had seagull poop welds and the frames were crooked. then chromo looptail with nice welds. then the design change bevel tail seatstays stop at seatmast and went to reynolds. then another design change bevel tail seatstays go past seatmast and went to chromo. there are yet other variations concerning a brace between the downtubes.
[ June 08, 2006, 12:08 PM: Message edited by: pgringo aka P.hilip K.elso ]
[ June 08, 2006, 12:08 PM: Message edited by: pgringo aka P.hilip K.elso ]
stamped on the BB...i believe they are stamped 000???, i think all mild steel were 000500 and below, so if yours is a low serial number, its probably a mild steelie!!!! after that, new materials chromo/reynolds/aluminum
hope my info is correct, if not, im sorry to side track you
Jon
hope my info is correct, if not, im sorry to side track you
Jon
What a find...Loop quad, GJS forks, Kuwahara bars, Titron pedals, PPP chainring...unbelievable find!!!
Tony
Tony
You are correct. mild steel looptails were first, then cromo looptails, both spanning from 79-82 (mild steel first, then cromo) then Reynolds design from 83- early 85, then redesigned cromo in mid 85-99 with 98 & 99 also offering the 6061 alloy model. The looptail on the mild steel version was a "bigger" loop and the cromo ones was a "tighter loop" like the PK's. I think the chromo ones were the ones with the cross brace between the double down tube. This brace reappeared on the mid 90's 1 1/8" headtube frames with the canti mounts. From the pic of yours with the tight loop and cross brace, its a chromo one. Check the bigger loop on this mild steel one. It belongs to Outfront.
[ June 08, 2006, 12:51 PM: Message edited by: BRIAN HAYS ]
[ June 08, 2006, 12:51 PM: Message edited by: BRIAN HAYS ]
Thanks Tony, we actually sold a number of the parts already, but before we sell the frame I want to know exactly what it is we have. Unfortunately, I think most of the serial number has been worn away on this frame, but I'll check tonight.
Thanks Brian. I think that would suggest that this IS a mild steel frame then?
Mild steel loops are stamped 00XXX, my number 00126. The loops on a mild steel are larger than the loops on a chromoloy or steel quad.
Nice ride you have there. The kuwi bars would work perfect on my new Kuwi pit....
Nice ride you have there. The kuwi bars would work perfect on my new Kuwi pit....
No, yours is a chromoly one. I just changed my post and added pics.
Wait, I re-read your post there Brian. I must have missed a line. Looks like ours is chomo. The loop looks tighter than the one you posted as well.
serial #.
various SE veterans put the number of mild steel frames built at 150 - 300.
if your serial # is below 300 its likely a mild steel frame. over 300, it's chromemoly.
various SE veterans put the number of mild steel frames built at 150 - 300.
if your serial # is below 300 its likely a mild steel frame. over 300, it's chromemoly.
Oh, that's why I was confused!
Thanks for the help!
Thanks for the help!
First loops were mild steel. Like OSPK said, the ser number is preceeded by 0s. Should be nice heavy stamp on top of BB.
From about 1980 to about end of 1982 were cro-mo loops. Early of those had the downtube cross brace. Ser number is sequential to order build and should be light not so straight stamps on bottom of BB.
I remember something about loop bend and rear dropout being different from mild to cro-mo - something about the dropout extends further below the bend on cro-mo ...but don't remember details and can't find with search
Not all cro-mo have nice welds. Mine is early of the cro-mo and it has poopy welds.
I think too that your black one is cro-mo
What is the number?
From about 1980 to about end of 1982 were cro-mo loops. Early of those had the downtube cross brace. Ser number is sequential to order build and should be light not so straight stamps on bottom of BB.
I remember something about loop bend and rear dropout being different from mild to cro-mo - something about the dropout extends further below the bend on cro-mo ...but don't remember details and can't find with search
Not all cro-mo have nice welds. Mine is early of the cro-mo and it has poopy welds.
I think too that your black one is cro-mo
What is the number?
Thanks, Andy. I have looked before for the serial # on the bottom of the BB, and much of it was worn away. I will try looking again tonight, though.
The reason why I asked is because I was having a hard time with the time frame as far as the cross braces were concerned. I wasn't sure if they came before or after the ones without the braces.
Then I read about this mild steel business...
After reading through all the EXTREMELY helpful information you guys already have given me, though, I'm pretty confident its an early chromo.
The reason why I asked is because I was having a hard time with the time frame as far as the cross braces were concerned. I wasn't sure if they came before or after the ones without the braces.
Then I read about this mild steel business...
After reading through all the EXTREMELY helpful information you guys already have given me, though, I'm pretty confident its an early chromo.
You would be correct. NOW GIVE IT TO ME.
lol, Brian. We'll have it and the Rascal frame all nicely wrapped for you. As soon as you win the auctions when we list them!
Now I do know of a chrome loop that was/is a team issued and it has no serial number on it.
The mild steel pictured of mine has poop welds, but I did ride the bike safely.
Just box yours up and send it to me I could use one for my son....
The mild steel pictured of mine has poop welds, but I did ride the bike safely.
Just box yours up and send it to me I could use one for my son....
quote:No problem. The shipping charges may be a bit high though!
Just box yours up and send it to me I could use one for my son....
I have my original looptail quad from BITD (I am bringing it to Rockford again!). A couple of years ago before I restored it, I brought it to Rockford.
While my serial number is way higher than 00XXX, both Scot and Mike D. Looked at it and thought it may actually be an original mild steel version. The basis for this was the absolute horse**** welds!
Before I had my frame blasted & painted I snipped off a small piece of the seat tube mast. I sent it to a metalurgist who confirmed is was not mild, but alloy steel.
The net result is the welds were ****ty looking on both the mild steel and alloy steel looptails!
The wierd thing I have still never figured out how old it really is? In my mind, I can backtrack my purchase to late 79 or early 80, but my serial number is like 0018XX. This would imply it is a very late quad may be as late as an 81 or 82. I know my motivation to have it was not to "be like Mike" but to "be like Stu". I believe Stu had not switched to Redline yet when I purchased it.
I know for sure I was more insterested in riding high school chicks than bikes in 82! I had switched to cars and girls and my Black & Gold 280z quickly replaced my Black & Gold Quadangle!
I know I moved in first semester of 81 to a new town. I have pictures of my quad at my old house and racing during the summer of 80. I remember purchasing from Sundance Cycle at their old location. When I add it up, I think this bike was purcased fall 79 or spring 80. I guess unless I find a receipt, I will never really know!
Some of you may have already seen it, but pix can be seen here:
http://homepage.mac.com/jpkelly/PhotoAlbum11.html
Can't wait to see all my brothers at Rockford!
John P. Kelly
While my serial number is way higher than 00XXX, both Scot and Mike D. Looked at it and thought it may actually be an original mild steel version. The basis for this was the absolute horse**** welds!
Before I had my frame blasted & painted I snipped off a small piece of the seat tube mast. I sent it to a metalurgist who confirmed is was not mild, but alloy steel.
The net result is the welds were ****ty looking on both the mild steel and alloy steel looptails!
The wierd thing I have still never figured out how old it really is? In my mind, I can backtrack my purchase to late 79 or early 80, but my serial number is like 0018XX. This would imply it is a very late quad may be as late as an 81 or 82. I know my motivation to have it was not to "be like Mike" but to "be like Stu". I believe Stu had not switched to Redline yet when I purchased it.
I know for sure I was more insterested in riding high school chicks than bikes in 82! I had switched to cars and girls and my Black & Gold 280z quickly replaced my Black & Gold Quadangle!
I know I moved in first semester of 81 to a new town. I have pictures of my quad at my old house and racing during the summer of 80. I remember purchasing from Sundance Cycle at their old location. When I add it up, I think this bike was purcased fall 79 or spring 80. I guess unless I find a receipt, I will never really know!
Some of you may have already seen it, but pix can be seen here:
http://homepage.mac.com/jpkelly/PhotoAlbum11.html
Can't wait to see all my brothers at Rockford!
John P. Kelly
My looptail is #1607, has crappy welds and is probably crooked also. It's my project for Rockford 2007. See everyone there this year.
Mild Steel looptail Quad frames have a serial numbers that start with a ZERO.
Chromoly looptail Quad frames start with a ONE.
Chromoly looptail Quad frames start with a ONE.
Guess I could finish the rest of it eh?
Serial Numbers changed in '82. Then they went to the "dated" serial numbers. Example 01 82 9999. Theoretically that is Jan '82. This was used up until '85. Then SE went to the "QA" serial numbers. There are also a few out there with "AS" (Assassin) serial numbers. The "QA" serial numbers were used until the end. They were used on the aluminum Quads also. Overseas aluminum Quads have the SN on the bottom bracket. I think those may start with a number instead.
Serial Numbers changed in '82. Then they went to the "dated" serial numbers. Example 01 82 9999. Theoretically that is Jan '82. This was used up until '85. Then SE went to the "QA" serial numbers. There are also a few out there with "AS" (Assassin) serial numbers. The "QA" serial numbers were used until the end. They were used on the aluminum Quads also. Overseas aluminum Quads have the SN on the bottom bracket. I think those may start with a number instead.
Always something to learn on the subject of early quads/str-1. Amazing amount of detail provided by the very informed members of this site.
I need to find the time to restore my early mild steel quad. When will it be?????
I need to find the time to restore my early mild steel quad. When will it be?????
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